I am not depressed, but I will never get a brain implant for any reason. The brain is the final frontier of privacy, it is the one place I am free. If that is taken away I am no longer truly autonomous, I am no longer truly myself.

I understand this is how older generations feel about lots of things, like smartphones, which I am writing this from, and I understand how stupid it sounds to say "but this is different!", but like... really. This is different. Whatever scale smartphones, drivers licenses, personalized ads, the internet, smart home speakers.... whatever scale all these things lie on in terms of "panopticon-ness", a brain implant is so exponentially further along that scale as to make all the others vanish to nothingness. You can't top a brain implant. A brain implant is a fundamentally unspeakable horror which would inevitably be used to subjugate entire peoples in a way so systematically flawless as to be almost irreversible.

This is how it starts. First it will be used for undeniable goods, curing depression, psychological ailments, anxiety, and so on. Next thing you know it'll be an optional way to pay your check at restaurants, file your taxes, read a recipe - convenience. Then it will be the main way to do those things, and then suddenly it will be the only way to do those things. And once you have no choice but to use a brain implant to function in society, you'll have no choice but to accept "thought analytics" being reported to your government and corporations. No benefit is worth a brain implant, don't even think about it (but luckily, I can't tell if you do).

No no no no no

AI can't even do a google search right.

Keep that shit outta my head

I am not depressed, but I will never get a brain implant for any reason. The brain is the final frontier of privacy, it is the one place I am free. If that is taken away I am no longer truly autonomous, I am no longer truly myself.

I understand this is how older generations feel about lots of things, like smartphones, which I am writing this from, and I understand how stupid it sounds to say "but this is different!", but like... really. This is different. Whatever scale smartphones, drivers licenses, personalized ads, the internet, smart home speakers.... whatever scale all these things lie on in terms of "panopticon-ness", a brain implant is so exponentially further along that scale as to make all the others vanish to nothingness. You can't top a brain implant. A brain implant is a fundamentally unspeakable horror which would inevitably be used to subjugate entire peoples in a way so systematically flawless as to be almost irreversible.

This is how it starts. First it will be used for undeniable goods, curing depression, psychological ailments, anxiety, and so on. Next thing you know it'll be an optional way to pay your check at restaurants, file your taxes, read a recipe - convenience. Then it will be the main way to do those things, and then suddenly it will be the only way to do those things. And once you have no choice but to use a brain implant to function in society, you'll have no choice but to accept "thought analytics" being reported to your government and corporations. No benefit is worth a brain implant, don't even think about it (but luckily, I can't tell if you do).

This seems interesting, i'll read it fully after work if i don't forget.

Something has me convinced i'm depressed but the only time i ever had the posibility to look for help they sort of just worked me towards the door and cut me off asap.

But they ended up giving me some sort of anti psychotic medication, which definitely allowed me to get back on my feet at the time. (Shit was dark, i fell in a hole with covid, homelessness and unemployment alltogether with my wife and reached a point where i struggled so much i couldn't even get my ass to a job interview).

But i still don't know what the cause of my struggles is, only that they've been around as long as i can remember. Some form of psychotic whatever wouldn't surprise me either looking at my mom and what she did. But from what i know (which isn't a lot obviously) it seems more like depression.

"What am I without my legs?" "What am I without my eyes?" "What am I without my arms?"

What counts as "the real me" has been evolving for decades, if not centuries. I'm not volunteering for brain implants, but I'm not writing off the idea sometime in the future. As for AI, this is going to be more of the ML variety, not the LLM variety. Think more of "neurochemical levels have been trending in a certain direction for too long, release opposing neurochemicals to halt the spiral" and less of a little voice inside your head giving quite possibly incorrect answers to whatever you're thinking of.

This is absolutely risky stuff, but less risky than recurring electroshock therapy? Hard for me to say. Note that the article is from nearly 2 decades ago, but there are articles in the news from just the last couple weeks.

Those are some good nuances that definitely require a nuanced response and forced me to refine my thinking, thank you! I'm actually not claiming that the brain is the sole boundary of the real me, rather it is the majority of me, but my body is a contributor. The real me does change as my body changes, just in less meaningful ways. Likewise some changes in the brain change the real me more than others. However, regardless of what constitutes the real me or not, (and believe me, the philosophical rabbit hole there is one I love to explore), in this case I'm really just talking about the straightforward immediate implications of a brain implant on my privacy. An arm implant would also be quite bad in this regard, but a brain implant is clearly worse.

There have already been systems that can display very rough, garbled images of what people are thinking of. I'm less worried about an implant that tells me what to do or controls me directly, and more worried about an implant that has a pretty accurate picture of my thoughts and reports it to authorities. It's surely possible to build a system that can approximate positive or negative mood states, and in combination this is very dangerous. If the government can tell that I'm happy when I think about Luigi Mangione, then they can respond to that information however they want. Eventually, in the same way that I am conditioned by the panopticon to stop at stop sign, even in the middle of a desolate desert where I can see for miles around that there are no cars, no police, no cameras - no anything that could possibly make a difference to me running the stop sign - the system will similarly condition automatic compliance in thoughts themselves. That is, compliance is brought about not by any actual exertion of power or force, but merely by the omnipresent possibility of its exertion.

(For this we only need moderately complex brain implants, not sophisticated ones that actually control us physiologically.)

So, their AI is confidently wrong over 60% of the time, and they thought implanting it into people's brains was a good idea?? Wtf???

Tell me you don’t understand what depression is without telling me you don’t understand what depression is. You can be depressed while living for free on a beach with no responsibilities. To suggest you can fix everyone’s depression with external changes is the height of “just go outside and you’ll feel better.”

Depression replaced with horror?

I'll take it.

Chronic depression since a traumatic event trigger in 1989 here. They can shove those chips up their own arse.

Horror might be more entertaining than depression, but the sheer idea of letting some techbro implant shit in my brain is so ridiculous, I'd probably try DIY lobotomy before I consider the AI option.

Imagine witholding a medicine from a sick person, telling them it's the world that's broken. That's some Mother Teresa level evil.

Nope I'd definitely kill myself before letting an ai fuck with my brain

I likely had undiagnosed depression for decades before I got treatment, from a GP, no less, after being dismissed by a psychiatrist. If you have concerns about your health, keep trying to get help, as long as you're able.

As someone who is literally living where others go on holidays while depressed let me tell you my depression is very much a response to the world being a rotting shithole. I am not sad because my life sucks but because so many others are suffering and I feel powerless to change it. The narrative of 'chemical imbalance' is a very reductive and misleading one.

The feeling of powerlessness and disconnect also points to the cure I find for myself. Instead of implanting experimental BS inventions into my brain I try to be a force of connection, community and hope for others. There is very few things I can do as a single tiny person, but in these very small things lies the power of change for the better.

To be clear, I’m not claiming all depression can’t be influenced from external factors. And any BCI claiming to solve all depression should be treated like the plague. But there are types of depression that are solely a chemical imbalance that cannot be corrected through external means. And yeah, the “all depression is just a chemical imbalance” narrative is horribly flawed. But to claim none of them are a chemical imbalance is just as bad.

Our current treatment for such types of depression are essentially still in the stone ages. Throw something at it, see what happens, adjust as needed. If a BCI can work around such a situation and offer a direct and targeted approach to the issue, and it goes through extensive testing, I don’t see why this wouldn’t be a good potential solution.