When NASA was developing the rocket to go to the moon (the Apollo V) they had their large shares of failures, exactly like SpaceX is having now while developing Starship (and before it, the Falcon 9) which is even more complex and bigger than the Apollo V.

this is a specious comparison. NASA was racing the soviets using 1950 and 60's tech, and it cost lives, but there was a driving motivation for the tempo (kennedy's goal of humans on the moon first). There's no contemporary equivalent. And no NASA director was EVER ON HORSE DRUGS. Period.

Nor did any NASA director ever try to manage multiple fortune 500 companies WHILE on ketamine while DANCING AROUND WITH A CHAINSAW and fucking with our government.

Your comparison is invalid.

Wait, do you really think that Musk is the one that is doing all the jobs at Tesla and SpaceX ?

No, I think he's distorting the work of thousands of talented people (Shotwell down) for EGO. If he truly cared he'd step down.

None of this is complex. I'm glad you speak english well enough to reorder your thoughts in a comprehensible manner, but the premise remains unchanged. Musk represents a larger threat to SpaceX and NASA and the US than any potential benefit to those same parties.

I will feel free to attack musk, didn't need your permission but thanks!

When NASA was developing the rocket to go to the moon (the Apollo V) they had their large shares of failures, exactly like SpaceX is having now while developing Starship (and before it, the Falcon 9) which is even more complex and bigger than the Apollo V.

this is a specious comparison. NASA was racing the soviets using 1950 and 60’s tech, and it cost lives, but there was a driving motivation for the tempo (kennedy’s goal of humans on the moon first). There’s no contemporary equivalent. And no NASA director was EVER ON HORSE DRUGS. Period.

Your comparison is invalid.

Only if you could link the fact that Musk is on horse drugs with the fact that Starship explodes.
The starting point was that I dismissed the point that Musk is ruining SpaceX (since Starship's test are not that good) and the fact that he is on drugs.

Nor did any NASA director ever try to manage multiple fortune 500 companies WHILE on ketamine while DANCING AROUND WITH A CHAINSAW and fucking with our government.

I don't see the problem: NASA was a state agency, SpaceX is private.
What I can see from here is that Musk is doing the right thing (trying to make the government more efficient and cheaper) using a completely wrong method, to which I agree.

Wait, do you really think that Musk is the one that is doing all the jobs at Tesla and SpaceX ?

No, I think he’s distorting the work of thousands of talented people (Shotwell down) for EGO. If he truly cared he’d step down.

I don't think it could do it anymore, at least not to the level you think.

Musk represents a larger threat to SpaceX and NASA and the US than any potential benefit to those same parties.

I am not sure. What I think from here (Europe) is that, as I said, Musk is doing the right thing in the wrong (very wrong) way if we speak about DOGE. If we speak about SpaceX and Tesla, well, it don't seems to do that bad after all.

I don’t see the problem: NASA was a state agency, SpaceX is private.

lives are literally at stake, grow the fuck up.

Elon Musk decided to wreck USAID. The death toll is ghoulish. This dickwad said "the fundamental weakness of western civilization is empathy".

If we speak about SpaceX and Tesla, well, it don’t seems to do that bad after all.

haha tesla is cratering in the EU and that cybertruck sure is a winner. pfft

Tesla's monthly sales in Europe plunge by almost 50% amid protests and backlash against Elon Musk

Tesla's brand is the focus of a backlash against CEO Elon Musk for his political views and involvement with President Trump's DOGE.

(www.cbsnews.com)

Cybertruck Sales Are So Bad That We Gasped

In the entire first quarter of 2025, Tesla has managed to sell just 7,100 Cybertrucks in the US, according to data from S&P Global Mobility.

Futurism (futurism.com)

You are so detached from reality it's disgusting. This discussion has been absolutely pointless.

A strawman is when somebody mischaracterize an argument, calling someone a tankie is not that.

And this is relevant how?

I mean companies can force him out by themselves if they're pressured enough. Also all companies make unsuccessful business bets. What matters is that from a neutral third person point of view, these companies aren't doing anything that they're not supposed to be doing. They're putting sectors of the American economy in danger of collapse, they're not committing crimes left and right, and their services are satisfactory for most people.

They landed people on the moon and then did fuck all for decades.

Indeed, all i was saying is that they were capable given budget and circumstances.

That budget and direction comes from the government.

When Musk started SpaceX he was not well known yet, SpaceX came before Tesla.

I will admit, i thought spacex was just another company he bought his way in to, like tesla, seems i was mistaken about that.

He was able to get into the businesses he has because he was rich yes, but you can find many accounts of engineers that worked under him speak of how good he was at finding ways to cut unnecessary costs.

And you can equally find many accounts of having to distract him from the day to day operations because he's unreliable , unpredictable and chaotic (none of those meant in a good way).

He's also known for buying good press and using litigation to silence people.

He’s not a technical genius that’s for sure. But he has been a good CEO for SpaceX.

I doubt this, but that could just be bias, i don't have any actual evidence of the long term impact of him as CEO.

Recently though, he's provably been significantly more of a liability than a benefit, even if just from a PR and public sentiment point of view.

But I refuse to simply wave away his achievements simply because I don’t like him. I can not like someone and still acknowledge they have done something good.

Indeed, i push back on the myth that he's some self made tony stark genius, but it isn't like he's not achieved anything.

I would personally attribute most of that to neptoism, wealth, luck and opportunity, but that doesn't remove the achievement itself.

If NASA had as many rockets explode as SpaceX has, people like you would be screaming about the waste of taxpayer dollars.

The point of the launches that have ended in explosion were to test various parts of the systems and hardware, and to learn if/when a "disaster" does happen. That's how you improve things, make them better and safer. Would you prefer when we finally send people to the moon or to Mars that it's the first time we've launched that rocket? Those explosions weren't bad things.

Are you for real? Can you guess how many Saturn V rockets ended up exploding throughout the first mission to put man on the moon? Trick question, the answer was ZERO.

The Saturn V program had completed more successful milestones in 1 year than SpaceX has managed in 5 year.

SpaceX has been late on every single deliverable to NASA. They were supposed to show they can reliably perform the propellant transfer for the NASA contract, and instead Musk focused on testing the deployment of starlink satellites, which of course failed. And now they lost one more on the pad getting fueled up.

It's complete incompetence, which is the one thing Musk can guarantee