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Why is the manosphere on the rise? UN Women sounds the alarm over online misogyny

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  • It's quite simple, gender equality should stand for equal opportunity for both genders, but it's not. I only see women being pushed into places with traditionally male majority, but not men being pushed into places with traditional female majority. And worst of all, equal opportunity should not mean we will hire a less competent woman that a more competent men, to fill out some 50/50 quota.

    This is exactly the result of abusing gender equality.

    I only see women being pushed into places with traditionally male majority, but not men being pushed into places with traditional female majority

    Genuinely curious, got any examples of “traditional female majority places” that masculine individuals cannot enter/participate in?

  • I only see women being pushed into places with traditionally male majority, but not men being pushed into places with traditional female majority

    Genuinely curious, got any examples of “traditional female majority places” that masculine individuals cannot enter/participate in?

    Not OP, but positions like nurses or teachers are very female dominated.
    It's not like males cannot reach those positions, but there are social obstacles to that.
    To make an example from my country, in Italy primary school teachers are > 90% female. I believe in kindergarten they reach 97 or 98%.
    This is also partially the result of strict gender roles than discriminate both men and women in terms of caring for children (I.e., women are de facto forced to do that, men are pushed away), which then reinforces the social practice of women doing all the caring jobs.

    This is IMHO a problem for both men and women, but probably it's not from the same perspective as what OP meant...

  • Not OP, but positions like nurses or teachers are very female dominated.
    It's not like males cannot reach those positions, but there are social obstacles to that.
    To make an example from my country, in Italy primary school teachers are > 90% female. I believe in kindergarten they reach 97 or 98%.
    This is also partially the result of strict gender roles than discriminate both men and women in terms of caring for children (I.e., women are de facto forced to do that, men are pushed away), which then reinforces the social practice of women doing all the caring jobs.

    This is IMHO a problem for both men and women, but probably it's not from the same perspective as what OP meant...

    positions like nurses or teachers are very female dominated.

    I’m sure it varies from country to country, but in the US women could not study medicine until the late 1800’s and the US Army did not allow female physicians until 1940.

    It’s not unlikely to think we have many people today who were alive before women practicing as physicians was common place.

    I’m convinced it’s less of a matter of a group “dominating” a space but rather being pigeonholed/forced into it due to a lack of options, and these circumstances have impact that are still felt to this day.

    I’m not sure about Italy but in a lot of the US becoming a school teacher requires a college degree and has wages that do not keep up with the cost of living.

    You can look up articles of teachers losing their jobs for doing sex work or provocative modeling to earn extra income because their job does not pay enough.

    Doesn’t seem like that big of a win? Unless I’m missing something?

    Edit: re-read your reply and realized I did not read it properly the first time. That’ll teach me to comment in the wee hours LOL. I greatly appreciate your response! Leaving the original reply in place for the sake of context.

  • It's quite simple, gender equality should stand for equal opportunity for both genders, but it's not. I only see women being pushed into places with traditionally male majority, but not men being pushed into places with traditional female majority. And worst of all, equal opportunity should not mean we will hire a less competent woman that a more competent men, to fill out some 50/50 quota.

    This is exactly the result of abusing gender equality.

    I feel like a Cassandra since I was warning about this for years now.

    The gender equality narrative got too focused on excluding men specifically, instead of including the less represented gender in each profession. Somehow the idea was that men are privileged in the system and women oppressed, while the truth is that both men and women are oppressed.

    Divide and conquer was a small step away from that point.

  • positions like nurses or teachers are very female dominated.

    I’m sure it varies from country to country, but in the US women could not study medicine until the late 1800’s and the US Army did not allow female physicians until 1940.

    It’s not unlikely to think we have many people today who were alive before women practicing as physicians was common place.

    I’m convinced it’s less of a matter of a group “dominating” a space but rather being pigeonholed/forced into it due to a lack of options, and these circumstances have impact that are still felt to this day.

    I’m not sure about Italy but in a lot of the US becoming a school teacher requires a college degree and has wages that do not keep up with the cost of living.

    You can look up articles of teachers losing their jobs for doing sex work or provocative modeling to earn extra income because their job does not pay enough.

    Doesn’t seem like that big of a win? Unless I’m missing something?

    Edit: re-read your reply and realized I did not read it properly the first time. That’ll teach me to comment in the wee hours LOL. I greatly appreciate your response! Leaving the original reply in place for the sake of context.

    I’m sure it varies from country to country, but in the US women could not study medicine until the late 1800’s

    In Germany at the moment around two thirds of medicine students are women and I wouldn't be surprised if it's the similar in most western countries.

  • It's quite simple, gender equality should stand for equal opportunity for both genders, but it's not. I only see women being pushed into places with traditionally male majority, but not men being pushed into places with traditional female majority. And worst of all, equal opportunity should not mean we will hire a less competent woman that a more competent men, to fill out some 50/50 quota.

    This is exactly the result of abusing gender equality.

    And it started from that valid criticism and then takes the viewer on a tour by various faces and influencers to pull them into more and more into right-wing territory to radicalize them. Once in that box, they're not getting out again. It's a right-wing conveyor belt.

  • positions like nurses or teachers are very female dominated.

    I’m sure it varies from country to country, but in the US women could not study medicine until the late 1800’s and the US Army did not allow female physicians until 1940.

    It’s not unlikely to think we have many people today who were alive before women practicing as physicians was common place.

    I’m convinced it’s less of a matter of a group “dominating” a space but rather being pigeonholed/forced into it due to a lack of options, and these circumstances have impact that are still felt to this day.

    I’m not sure about Italy but in a lot of the US becoming a school teacher requires a college degree and has wages that do not keep up with the cost of living.

    You can look up articles of teachers losing their jobs for doing sex work or provocative modeling to earn extra income because their job does not pay enough.

    Doesn’t seem like that big of a win? Unless I’m missing something?

    Edit: re-read your reply and realized I did not read it properly the first time. That’ll teach me to comment in the wee hours LOL. I greatly appreciate your response! Leaving the original reply in place for the sake of context.

    Like another comment stated about Germany, even in Italy medicine faculties have a majority of women today as well.

    I agree that in general teacher jobs are not glamorous or high-paying, but it's still a very important role in society and we can still discuss how it's a problem that there is an effective (social, mostly) barrier for males accessing (lower level) education jobs.

    I do believe that this is essentially another symptom of a wider problem related to gender roles.

  • According to the Movember Foundation, a leading men’s health organization and partner of UN Women, two-thirds of young men regularly engage with masculinity influencers online.

    While some content offers genuine support, much of it promotes extreme language and sexist ideology, reinforcing the idea that men are victims of feminism and modern social change.

    So, 2/3 of young men are risking to become incels, right? Because it is hard to imagine a young girl who is looking for a partner with hyperfocus on his own masculinity as well as a partner, who portraits himself as victim? That is sad...

    That statistics is bullshit that would be 66% of all young men

  • A growing network of online communities known collectively as the “manosphere” is emerging as a serious threat to gender equality, as toxic digital spaces increasingly influence real-world attitudes, behaviours, and policies, the UN agency dedicated to ending gender discrimination has warned.

    Am I tripping, out of touch with reality? These people really don't seem to understand the problem and that makes me seriously question their methodology.

  • Like another comment stated about Germany, even in Italy medicine faculties have a majority of women today as well.

    I agree that in general teacher jobs are not glamorous or high-paying, but it's still a very important role in society and we can still discuss how it's a problem that there is an effective (social, mostly) barrier for males accessing (lower level) education jobs.

    I do believe that this is essentially another symptom of a wider problem related to gender roles.

    I do believe that this is essentially another symptom of a wider problem related to gender roles.

    Certainly agree with you there and I really appreciate your nuanced take.

    I think many miss the greater overarching message that forcing gender roles only serves to hold us back as a human race.

  • I feel like a Cassandra since I was warning about this for years now.

    The gender equality narrative got too focused on excluding men specifically, instead of including the less represented gender in each profession. Somehow the idea was that men are privileged in the system and women oppressed, while the truth is that both men and women are oppressed.

    Divide and conquer was a small step away from that point.

    I think there is nuance here. My understanding is that there is a very small but loud percentage of women that want to exclude men. When DEI (inclusion of less represented individuals) is encouraged, it's often cut down by "only the most qualified should be hired", detracting from the core topic which is bias. Most of the discourse around privilege was to help understand that men aren't actively oppressive, but many are blind to the ways in which they contribute to the oppressive issues due to cultural programming. In parallel to what we're seeing with protests - inaction is not helpful. Those that are privileged are more likely to be able to change the minds of those that are actively oppressive.
    TL;DR privilege is just the ability to apply peer pressure.

  • Am I tripping, out of touch with reality? These people really don't seem to understand the problem and that makes me seriously question their methodology.

    Am I tripping, out of touch with reality? These people really don't seem to understand the problem

    How so? Can you explain what do you mean here exactly?

  • It's quite simple, gender equality should stand for equal opportunity for both genders, but it's not. I only see women being pushed into places with traditionally male majority, but not men being pushed into places with traditional female majority. And worst of all, equal opportunity should not mean we will hire a less competent woman that a more competent men, to fill out some 50/50 quota.

    This is exactly the result of abusing gender equality.

    It blows my mind how comments that don't fit the narrative of the liberals get down voted to doom and canceled, by the same groups that want "equality", but only if it's their definition of equality.

    I'm all for equality, which is why I can't stand left-wingers or right-wingers. They're all full of shit.

  • I only see women being pushed into places with traditionally male majority, but not men being pushed into places with traditional female majority

    Genuinely curious, got any examples of “traditional female majority places” that masculine individuals cannot enter/participate in?

    Daycare, men who work with children in general. It feels like taboo, and I assume it's because the general opinion seems to be that men that want to be around children are most likely pedophiles. I never heard of a program to include more men in daycare.

  • Not OP, but positions like nurses or teachers are very female dominated.
    It's not like males cannot reach those positions, but there are social obstacles to that.
    To make an example from my country, in Italy primary school teachers are > 90% female. I believe in kindergarten they reach 97 or 98%.
    This is also partially the result of strict gender roles than discriminate both men and women in terms of caring for children (I.e., women are de facto forced to do that, men are pushed away), which then reinforces the social practice of women doing all the caring jobs.

    This is IMHO a problem for both men and women, but probably it's not from the same perspective as what OP meant...

    The difference is that, typically, the lack of women in male-dominated fields is due to them being actively pushed away from things they want to do, while the lack of men in female-dominated fields is due to those fields being less prestigious/well-paid (often due to being traditionally female) and them not wanting to pick them in the first place. But when they do decide to enter those fields, nobody's actively trying to stop/discourage them.

    Superficially there may seem to be similarities in circumstance, but the amount of agency men and women have to enter opposite-gender-dominated careers is vastly different.

  • It blows my mind how comments that don't fit the narrative of the liberals get down voted to doom and canceled, by the same groups that want "equality", but only if it's their definition of equality.

    I'm all for equality, which is why I can't stand left-wingers or right-wingers. They're all full of shit.

    Personally, I don't mind seeing when comments are heavily down voted. If an opinion is unpopular, that's ok, especially in some areas where you generally know there's a likely bias in the audience.

    What annoys me is seeing comments removed / silenced by mods when the comments dont align. If the comments calling for explicit violence or using overt slurs, by all means censor. But many online spaces will eliminate even respectful / neutral comments simply because they aren't in line with that narrative.

  • That statistics is bullshit that would be 66% of all young men

    Sounds reasonable.

  • I feel like a Cassandra since I was warning about this for years now.

    The gender equality narrative got too focused on excluding men specifically, instead of including the less represented gender in each profession. Somehow the idea was that men are privileged in the system and women oppressed, while the truth is that both men and women are oppressed.

    Divide and conquer was a small step away from that point.

    The gender equality narrative got too focused on excluding men

    As a man, I've never been made to feel excluded by gender equality in any way whatsoever.

  • Am I tripping, out of touch with reality? These people really don't seem to understand the problem and that makes me seriously question their methodology.

    The manosphere is easy to understand. People hate doing work and taking accountability. So just blame the problems on someone else, and watch my podcast and buy my shit.

  • Daycare, men who work with children in general. It feels like taboo, and I assume it's because the general opinion seems to be that men that want to be around children are most likely pedophiles. I never heard of a program to include more men in daycare.

    Excellent example, and I sincerely appreciate you engaging in good faith discussion!

    I agree that being masculine should by default not be a barrier - social or otherwise - from working with children.

    How do we begin to change that as a society?

    Although I can’t think of the solution myself, I also don’t see how advancing equality for feminine individuals would hold back equality for masculine individuals.

    As mentioned in another comment, a lot of these problems seem to stem from the enforcement of dated gender norms.

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    alaknar@sopuli.xyzA
    I think it would be infinitely better for an LLM to walk a user through the use of the formula in their specific use case rather than do it for them The one time I used it (via the Microsoft 365 Copilot), that's exactly what it did. It only created the table in the spreadsheet that I wanted and then explained how to do the formula, explained the bits and bobs of the formula, showed me the code and told me where to put it. Sure, if I was lazy, I'd just copy-paste without thinking, but the information was there. but that won’t sell as well because most people don’t want to learn to use a spreadsheet they just want to do a thing and move on to something else (...) with an asterisk and fine print stating that it’s for entertainment purposes only and that whoever isn’t liable for any false information At the same time, you could be arguing that calculators should be teaching people how to do maths, instead of just giving them the result, right? It's actually a bit similar to LLMs, because, well, if you don't know how maths and calculators work, you can get a result that's horribly wrong (try 3+2*3 on any simple calculator and you'll get 15). I just had my place of work upgrade me to Windows 11 this week (...) I was directed by Microsoft to download the “Office 365 Copilot” app which downloaded the office installer So, first of all, it sucks that your IT didn't have the tools to handle this for you in the first place. Secondly - that's just Microsoft being Microsoft. They love changing names and making things as confusing as possible. Although now Copilot is part of that app, when they originally introduced the new name, it was just a rebranded Microsoft 365 App. We were joking that it was done by some middle manager so he could boast that "100% of Office users now utilise Copilot". Last time I tried to use it I was given hallucinated nonexistant python modules and powershell commands that wasted my time I haven't yet seen an LLM that didn't invent PowerShell modules, although recently Copilot's been pretty good.
  • VPN company Mullvad reminds users it will no longer use OpenVPN

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    This post makes it look like there's something serious ly wrong with openvpn, but it's just them not wanting to deal with it and deprecating it. Oh well, guess Ill put a note not to use them. My country blocks VPN protocols and wg specifically, so for my usecase I need as many protocols supported as possible, preferrably mimicking other innocuous protocols.
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    dyskolos@lemmy.zipD
    I'd sniff a line of that hopium too. I just don't see it being available in the foreseeable future. At least not for an affordable price
  • Apple Just Proved They're No Different Than Google

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    2 ads when Linus mentioned candy crush. There is zero flow to youtube anymore
  • This Is Why Tesla’s Robotaxi Launch Needed Human Babysitters

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    Karel es hone
  • Cloudflare built an oauth provider with Claude

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    I have to say that you just have to sayed something up
  • How the Signal Knockoff App TeleMessage Got Hacked in 20 Minutes

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    Not to mention TeleMessage violated the terms of the GPL. Signal is under gpl and I can't find TeleMessage's code anywhere. Edit: it appears it is online somewhere just not in a github repo or anything https://micahflee.com/heres-the-source-code-for-the-unofficial-signal-app-used-by-trump-officials/
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    The new Pebble watches look interesting. Relatively basic, but long battery life (they promise) and open-source operating system.