UK wants to weasel out of demand for Apple encryption back door
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I'm not claiming they don't. I'm pointing out the absurdity of calling somebody out for not doing the impossible.
I didn't say "prove", I used another word with bigger allowance. Of "likely backdoors vs likely not" kind. I wanted to say that their "public" conflicts with governments and their statements of the "trust us, we won't sell you" kind are all worth nothing, because being caught lying won't cost them anything.
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In theory you can learn mind reading from some fantasy universe and check every Apple person. Or ask a crystal ball. Or use some other way to collect full information about our universe, check every rabbit hole, so to say, and then confidently confirm "there's no Apple backdoor here". "Here" meaning this plane of existence.
In practice yes.
EDIT: Forgot - the "refused to cooperate" and "they have disagreements" things even in daily wisdom don't change the probability of Apple having made backdoors. It's PR. You most likely won't learn it from the news if they do, in fact, cooperate.
Even in your made up scenario it doesn't prove the negative. Maybe your mind reading didn't work because Apple has a mind wiping device that made them forget. Maybe the crystal ball didn't work because Apple made an even more powerful "crystal ball blocking" device. You can't prove that's not what's really happening.
So no, you in fact can't prove a negative.
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Even in your made up scenario it doesn't prove the negative. Maybe your mind reading didn't work because Apple has a mind wiping device that made them forget. Maybe the crystal ball didn't work because Apple made an even more powerful "crystal ball blocking" device. You can't prove that's not what's really happening.
So no, you in fact can't prove a negative.
With that additional detail in possibilities it's also not possible to ever fully prove a positive.
My example was with an assumption that you have the full information. Hypothetically.
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Feck you too, I guess. If that's how you want to behave.
I could understand you being unhappy with our government, but just blanket swearing at all 68 million of us is a dick move.
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Let’s not even get into the legitimacy of a state calling itself “The UK of GB and NI” when they’d have a tough time proving NI is entirely onboard
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I didn't say "prove", I used another word with bigger allowance. Of "likely backdoors vs likely not" kind. I wanted to say that their "public" conflicts with governments and their statements of the "trust us, we won't sell you" kind are all worth nothing, because being caught lying won't cost them anything.
What WOULD you consider evidence of them not having backdoors, then?
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Let’s not even get into the legitimacy of a state calling itself “The UK of GB and NI” when they’d have a tough time proving NI is entirely onboard
A lot of GB isn't either, to be fair.
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They should allow a backdoor, but only on UK Parliament members' phones.
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Dude identifes as a country
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Ask them for a backdoor to their wives for "national security"
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They should allow a backdoor, but only on UK Parliament members' phones.
Could add cameras in their homes and work, so we can monitor them 24/7 with AI.
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What WOULD you consider evidence of them not having backdoors, then?
Everything FOSS and a good regular security audit
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A lot of GB isn't either, to be fair.
It should be renamed to, London plus all surrounding bits of land that we don't care about. It's a bit of a mouthful but it would be a more accurate name
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Dude identifes as a country
New gender just dropped
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The funny thing is, advanced data protection was optional, and not on by default. Apple just stopped offering it in the UK
How to turn on Advanced Data Protection for iCloud - Apple Support
Advanced Data Protection for iCloud offers our highest level of cloud data security and protects the majority of your iCloud data using end-to-end encryption.
Apple Support (support.apple.com)
When it’s enabled, they can’t access iCloud data at all, even with a warrant due to the fact it’s E2E with keys they don’t control. That’s what the UK got really mad about. But Apple shut the whole feature down for the UK in response to the backdoor ask.
It’s not different from the UK banning signal because it’s E2E encrypted and they can’t access it.
They’re likely only backing down now because of consumer/media backlash
Apple would need to supply the data if they had the encryption key right? So can we assume that even Apple cannot see the encrypted data?
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Apple would need to supply the data if they had the encryption key right? So can we assume that even Apple cannot see the encrypted data?
Correct, standard iCloud data is accessible with a warrant. But the UK wanted their own backdoor so they have constant access without a warrant.
But with advanced data protection, Apple can’t provide the data because they don’t have the encryption keys, regardless of a warrant.
Important to note iMessage is always E2E encrypted though, so iMessages cannot be accessed even with a warrant. Advanced data protection just expands that to all iCloud data
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The whole having a backdoor to encryption is bullshit, that defeats the entire point.
I do understand that they want some kind of control on things like encryption, since criminals/terrorist/etc can abuse it as well. Keeping society safe is kinda important, and some level of transparency is used for that. This like deposited annual reports for example will help find companies/people funding terrorism.
But we should never completely compromise the privacy of individuals
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Correct, standard iCloud data is accessible with a warrant. But the UK wanted their own backdoor so they have constant access without a warrant.
But with advanced data protection, Apple can’t provide the data because they don’t have the encryption keys, regardless of a warrant.
Important to note iMessage is always E2E encrypted though, so iMessages cannot be accessed even with a warrant. Advanced data protection just expands that to all iCloud data
Okay interesting, thank you for the info.
Who even uses iMessage these days? Pretty sure I turned it off completely because it was messing with the 5 SMS I send in a year ...
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Okay interesting, thank you for the info.
Who even uses iMessage these days? Pretty sure I turned it off completely because it was messing with the 5 SMS I send in a year ...
iMessage is far more common in the US afaik. Whereas most people elsewhere will use WhatsApp or whatever, nobody in my extended family uses anything but iMessage to communicate
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iMessage is far more common in the US afaik. Whereas most people elsewhere will use WhatsApp or whatever, nobody in my extended family uses anything but iMessage to communicate
Ah, yeah right, the US is still stuck in the 00s with that (and payment methods).
But iMessage doesn't work on Android and by default the message will just fail if they have an Android phone and you use iMessage.
