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7 years later, Valve's Proton has been an incredible game-changer for Linux

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  • This is not a battle between Linux and Windows. It is a battle between the Steam Deck versus the Desktop PC platform (windows users). Stop with the claiming Linux marketshare over it.

    I'm off to celebrate how widely BSD is used because technically the Playstation uses it and the switch incorporates code from FreeBSD. BSD derivitives are the most popular game console OS. It's the year of BSD!

    This makes Linux desktop a viable option for millions of users where it wasn't before. It's absolutely a battle between Linux and Windows.

  • This is not a battle between Linux and Windows. It is a battle between the Steam Deck versus the Desktop PC platform (windows users). Stop with the claiming Linux marketshare over it.

    I'm off to celebrate how widely BSD is used because technically the Playstation uses it and the switch incorporates code from FreeBSD. BSD derivitives are the most popular game console OS. It's the year of BSD!

    Do you know what I did last week thanks to Proton? Installed EndeavourOS on my freshly purchased laptop, installed steam, and installed a bunch of Windows games. Then I played them. At no point did I wonder whether they would run.

    Now, you may think being able to do that isn't something that is going to get more people using desktop Linux (or that it hasn't already done so), but as much as I'd love to agree with you, then we'd both be wrong.

    I say this as someone who used to care about convincing other people to use Linux. (Before shifting into "you can lead a horse to water..." mode, and now I just don't give a shit.)

    However, what I gained from that experience is this: In twenty years of being Linux-only on my personal desktop, the number of times I have read the phrase, "I'd love to use Linux, except for [some statement about a game or games]" is astronomical.

    Now, is Proton going to make desktop Linux the best choice for everyone? Clearly not, duh. But it is remarkably disingenuous to suggest that it's not had a massive benefit to the Linux community and ecosystem as a whole, including, and dare I say especially, desktop Linux. It is flat out impossible to imagine that a substantial portion of current and future Linux users aren't people for whom Proton solved what they considered to be a substantial barrier to usage.

  • This is not a battle between Linux and Windows. It is a battle between the Steam Deck versus the Desktop PC platform (windows users). Stop with the claiming Linux marketshare over it.

    I'm off to celebrate how widely BSD is used because technically the Playstation uses it and the switch incorporates code from FreeBSD. BSD derivitives are the most popular game console OS. It's the year of BSD!

    Cry me a river..

  • This is not a battle between Linux and Windows. It is a battle between the Steam Deck versus the Desktop PC platform (windows users). Stop with the claiming Linux marketshare over it.

    I'm off to celebrate how widely BSD is used because technically the Playstation uses it and the switch incorporates code from FreeBSD. BSD derivitives are the most popular game console OS. It's the year of BSD!

    The Bazzite console I built which is connected to my living room TV stands in contradiction. The Linux-driven gaming PC that’s sitting on my desk is confirmation.

    Windows 11 and the forced obsolescence of hardware is leaving a sour aftertaste, and at this point a game maker essentially has to choose to not support Linux via Proton.

    You might not be able to run Battlefield or CoD, but Marvel Rivals and Overwatch run particularly well, if not better on Linux.

    And with Microsoft entering the handheld market, this is very much a question of Linux vs Windows for gaming.

  • This post did not contain any content.

    Whatever allows us to leave the clusterfuck that is Windows is a blessing. M$ has had a monopoly for too long and I'm not paying for MacOS.

  • This is not a battle between Linux and Windows. It is a battle between the Steam Deck versus the Desktop PC platform (windows users). Stop with the claiming Linux marketshare over it.

    I'm off to celebrate how widely BSD is used because technically the Playstation uses it and the switch incorporates code from FreeBSD. BSD derivitives are the most popular game console OS. It's the year of BSD!

    Fortunately Valve publishes monthly hardware statistics so we can back claims with statistics. Linux comprises 2.89% of their surveyed share. Of that 28.31% are using Steam OS. Using the wayback machine we can check the statistics from last year. Checking the July 2024 results using the Wayback Machine shows Linux at 2.08% with Steam OS comprising 40.97% of that.

    From that we can see that Linux is growing, while Steam OS is becoming less of a contributing factor to the Linux share.

  • This makes Linux desktop a viable option for millions of users where it wasn't before. It's absolutely a battle between Linux and Windows.

    Years ago I made the switch to Linux, then I wanted to play WOW again but it would not run on my Linux machines, so I started to dual boot. Then I began to wonder why I was keeping Linux installed.

    Eventually I made the shift to macOS because I worked in theatre and needed it for specific Mac only programs. But I still have a Lenovo legion that I am getting ready to swap over to Linux (not that all of the games I currently play do not run on macOS or my steam deck).

    If I was able to get WOW running on Linux years ago I likely never would have swapped back to windows. And I am currently trying to convince my son to install Linux on his pc running windows 10.

  • Proton existed long before the Steam Deck, and before that as DXVK.

    This is a battle between closed proprietary OS and open source. Proton enables translating DirectX/Windows APIs not only to Vulkan/Linux x86, but even to ARM and BSD.

    Couple technical nitpicks.

    First it's debatable if Proton existed long before Steam Deck. I'm not sure the exact timeline but I think it was created as part of the Steam Box effort which wasn't all that long ago. On the other hand though Wine which Proton is built on top of most certainly has existed for a very long time before either the Steam Deck or even Proton (I have fond memories of LAN gaming with it back when Diablo 2 was new).

    Second Proton doesn't enable ARM (at least by itself) so that claim is a little misleading. There is a project to realtime translate x86 instructions into ARM but that project (Box86) although it fulfills a similar role and could be used in conjunction with Proton isn't actually Proton. Using Proton by itself will not enable you to play x86/Windows games on ARM.

    Lastly Proton is kind of irrelevant to the whole Linux vs BSD thing. Technically what enables that is that both implement POSIX standards plus use mostly the same libraries, frameworks (like Vulkan), and applications. Yes running Proton on BSD will let you game on BSD but that isn't really a result of Proton doing the work so much as it's a side effect of the fact you can run Proton on BSD in the first place. Additionally while there are technical and philosophical reasons why the distinction between Linux and BSD is important, practically speaking they're the same thing these days. OpenBSD isn't that much more different from a Linux distro as one Linux distro is from another.

  • This is not a battle between Linux and Windows. It is a battle between the Steam Deck versus the Desktop PC platform (windows users). Stop with the claiming Linux marketshare over it.

    I'm off to celebrate how widely BSD is used because technically the Playstation uses it and the switch incorporates code from FreeBSD. BSD derivitives are the most popular game console OS. It's the year of BSD!

    If BSD had a the same software license as Linux then I would celebrate it running on PlayStation hardware as users would be more free. Instead PS consoles are locked-down, preventing you from running software you want to use unless daddy Sony says you can. It's a battle between consumer rights, including software freedom.

  • This is not a battle between Linux and Windows. It is a battle between the Steam Deck versus the Desktop PC platform (windows users). Stop with the claiming Linux marketshare over it.

    I'm off to celebrate how widely BSD is used because technically the Playstation uses it and the switch incorporates code from FreeBSD. BSD derivitives are the most popular game console OS. It's the year of BSD!

    Obligatory Steam Deck runs Linux BTW.

  • Whatever allows us to leave the clusterfuck that is Windows is a blessing. M$ has had a monopoly for too long and I'm not paying for MacOS.

    macOS has been free for, like, 15 years.

    Yes, you have to already own an Apple computer, but Apple users don’t pay for OS upgrades.

    Technically, anyone could download the OS images, but there’s not a lot that non-Apple users can do with them.

  • This is not a battle between Linux and Windows. It is a battle between the Steam Deck versus the Desktop PC platform (windows users). Stop with the claiming Linux marketshare over it.

    I'm off to celebrate how widely BSD is used because technically the Playstation uses it and the switch incorporates code from FreeBSD. BSD derivitives are the most popular game console OS. It's the year of BSD!

    I haven't booted windows in like 6 months and I game on my desktop PC like 4 times a week.

    Edit: also https://www.protondb.com/ distinguishes reports between steam deck and PC so you can see that people are using both there as well.

  • Years ago I made the switch to Linux, then I wanted to play WOW again but it would not run on my Linux machines, so I started to dual boot. Then I began to wonder why I was keeping Linux installed.

    Eventually I made the shift to macOS because I worked in theatre and needed it for specific Mac only programs. But I still have a Lenovo legion that I am getting ready to swap over to Linux (not that all of the games I currently play do not run on macOS or my steam deck).

    If I was able to get WOW running on Linux years ago I likely never would have swapped back to windows. And I am currently trying to convince my son to install Linux on his pc running windows 10.

    Strange, WOW should have been able to run. Maybe needed a command line switch to enable OpenGL for optimal performance. But back then Blizzard games had a great track record of Wine compatibility. I never had any problems with their games.

    There was one instance of Linux WOW players being banned for cheating. But that was rectified in a matter of days.

  • Strange, WOW should have been able to run. Maybe needed a command line switch to enable OpenGL for optimal performance. But back then Blizzard games had a great track record of Wine compatibility. I never had any problems with their games.

    There was one instance of Linux WOW players being banned for cheating. But that was rectified in a matter of days.

    This was 2006/2007 I think. Every article I read about it had a different solution and none worked fully.

    I also remember when I asked for help on wow centric forums being crappy replies of "don't use Linux" and when I would post on Linux centric spaces getting "don't play wow" replies.

  • Proton existed long before the Steam Deck, and before that as DXVK.

    This is a battle between closed proprietary OS and open source. Proton enables translating DirectX/Windows APIs not only to Vulkan/Linux x86, but even to ARM and BSD.

    Proton is mostly Wine, not DXVK. Wine does the translation of Windows and some DirectX APIs. DXVK translates Direct3D to Vulkan. Proton pulls it all together with some game specific patches, integration with gamescope and other Steam specific integrations.

    All of this being open source means it can also be compiled for ARM and BSD. Though to get x64 games to run on ARM you need an additional emulation layer like Box64.

    Though rumor has it that Valve is already experimenting with x64 emulation for their Deckard project, which is likely to be their next VR headset.

  • This was 2006/2007 I think. Every article I read about it had a different solution and none worked fully.

    I also remember when I asked for help on wow centric forums being crappy replies of "don't use Linux" and when I would post on Linux centric spaces getting "don't play wow" replies.

    Boo! I've added "help nocturne play wow on Linux" to my todo list when my time machine is done.

  • macOS has been free for, like, 15 years.

    Yes, you have to already own an Apple computer, but Apple users don’t pay for OS upgrades.

    Technically, anyone could download the OS images, but there’s not a lot that non-Apple users can do with them.

    Hackintosh is a thing (or at least used to be), but it’s against the EULA.

  • Fortunately Valve publishes monthly hardware statistics so we can back claims with statistics. Linux comprises 2.89% of their surveyed share. Of that 28.31% are using Steam OS. Using the wayback machine we can check the statistics from last year. Checking the July 2024 results using the Wayback Machine shows Linux at 2.08% with Steam OS comprising 40.97% of that.

    From that we can see that Linux is growing, while Steam OS is becoming less of a contributing factor to the Linux share.

    https://www.gamingonlinux.com/steam-tracker/ has some statistics from the Steam Survey. Somewhat interesting bit is that if you only take users who use English as the language in Steam, the Linux market share is 6.3%.

  • Fortunately Valve publishes monthly hardware statistics so we can back claims with statistics. Linux comprises 2.89% of their surveyed share. Of that 28.31% are using Steam OS. Using the wayback machine we can check the statistics from last year. Checking the July 2024 results using the Wayback Machine shows Linux at 2.08% with Steam OS comprising 40.97% of that.

    From that we can see that Linux is growing, while Steam OS is becoming less of a contributing factor to the Linux share.

    Someone citing actual facts on the internet?! Impossible!!

  • Couple technical nitpicks.

    First it's debatable if Proton existed long before Steam Deck. I'm not sure the exact timeline but I think it was created as part of the Steam Box effort which wasn't all that long ago. On the other hand though Wine which Proton is built on top of most certainly has existed for a very long time before either the Steam Deck or even Proton (I have fond memories of LAN gaming with it back when Diablo 2 was new).

    Second Proton doesn't enable ARM (at least by itself) so that claim is a little misleading. There is a project to realtime translate x86 instructions into ARM but that project (Box86) although it fulfills a similar role and could be used in conjunction with Proton isn't actually Proton. Using Proton by itself will not enable you to play x86/Windows games on ARM.

    Lastly Proton is kind of irrelevant to the whole Linux vs BSD thing. Technically what enables that is that both implement POSIX standards plus use mostly the same libraries, frameworks (like Vulkan), and applications. Yes running Proton on BSD will let you game on BSD but that isn't really a result of Proton doing the work so much as it's a side effect of the fact you can run Proton on BSD in the first place. Additionally while there are technical and philosophical reasons why the distinction between Linux and BSD is important, practically speaking they're the same thing these days. OpenBSD isn't that much more different from a Linux distro as one Linux distro is from another.

    Proton definitely existed before the Steam Deck was released.

    Proton had its initial release in 2018. I was using it on a linux desktop in 2019.

    The Steam Deck came out in 2022, after ~4 years of Proton improving from masses of desktop/laptop users running everything possible through it on all kinds of hardware to (auto) generate bug and crash reports for Valve (and others), who then of course actually developed it up to... I think Proton was at either 7 or 8 when the Deck actually came out, now we are on 9, 10 will probably come out of beta and be official Steam default by the end of the year.

    .........

    Also, Proton was not created as part of the Steam Box Machine, that was way earlier, back in 2015.

    Also also, the 'Steam Machine' was really more of just a minimum spec requirement than a specific product, the idea was to try to get other manufacturers to take their own crack at the concept, got a small amount of buy in, but not much.

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    noughtnaut@lemmy.worldN
    This is what I call "confidently wrong". If you ask it about things you have no clue about, it seems incredibly well-informed and insightful. Ask it something you know deeply, and you'll easily see it's just babbling and spouting nonsense - sure makes you wonder about those earlier statements it made, doesn't it?
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    rimu@piefed.socialR
    Yep It is a design choice to offer a news feed that combines verified news sources with tankie memes — interspersed with photos generated by AI I've really tried to provide tools to tame the meme flood and put them into effect on https://PieFed.social - compare that with the front-page (or All feed) of any Lemmy instance (or most PieFed instances, to be fair). Gen AI filter is coming.
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    At least with AI it's easy to see how shitty it gets as the codebase grows working on even a toy project over a week. Then again, if you have no frame of reference maybe that doesn't feel as awful as it should.
  • 454 Stimmen
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    eyekaytee@aussie.zoneE
    They will say something like solar went from 600gw to 1000 thats a 66% increase this year and coal only increased 40% except coal is 3600gw to 6400. Hrmmmm, maybe these numbers are outdated? Based on this coal and gas are down: In Q1 2025, solar generation rose 48% compared to the same period in 2024. Solar power reached 254 TWh, making up 10% of total electricity. This was the largest increase among all clean energy sources. Coal-fired electricity dropped by 4%, falling to 1,421 TWh. Gas-fired power also went down by 4%, reaching 67 TWh https://carboncredits.com/china-sets-clean-energy-record-in-early-2025-with-951-tw/ are no where close to what is required to meet their climate goals Which ones in particular are you talking about? Trump signs executive order directing US withdrawal from the Paris climate agreement — again https://apnews.com/article/trump-paris-agreement-climate-change-788907bb89fe307a964be757313cdfb0 China vowed on Tuesday to continue participating in two cornerstone multinational arrangements -- the World Health Organization and Paris climate accord -- after newly sworn-in US President Donald Trump ordered withdrawals from them. https://www.france24.com/en/live-news/20250121-china-says-committed-to-who-paris-climate-deal-after-us-pulls-out What's that saying? You hate it when the person you hate is doing good? I can't remember what it is I can't fault them for what they're doing at the moment, even if they are run by an evil dictatorship and do pollute the most I’m not sure how european defense spending is relevant It suggests there is money available in the bank to fund solar/wind/battery, but instead they are preparing for? something? what? who knows. France can make a fighter jet at home but not solar panels apparently. Prehaps they would be made in a country with environmental and labour laws if governments legislated properly to prevent companies outsourcing manufacturing. However this doesnt absolve china. China isnt being forced at Gunpoint to produce these goods with low labour regulation and low environmental regulation. You're right, it doesn't absolve china, and I avoid purchasing things from them wherever possible, my solar panels and EV were made in South Korea, my home battery was made in Germany, there are only a few things in my house made in China, most of them I got second hand but unfortunately there is no escaping the giant of manufacturing. With that said it's one thing for me to sit here and tut tut at China, but I realise I am not most people, the most clearest example is the extreme anti-ai, anti-billionaire bias on this platform, in real life most people don't give a fuck, they love Amazon/Microsoft/Google/Apple etc, they can't go a day without them. So I consider myself a realist, if you want people to buy your stuff then you will need to make the conditions possible for them to WANT to buy your stuff, not out of some moral lecture and Europe isn't doing that, if we look at energy prices: Can someone actually point out to me where this comes from? ... At the end of the day energy is a small % of EU household spending I was looking at corporate/business energy use: Major European companies are already moving to cut costs and retain their competitive edge. For example, Thyssenkrupp, Germany’s largest steelmaker, said on Monday it would slash 11,000 jobs in its steel division by 2030, in a major corporate reshuffle. https://oilprice.com/Latest-Energy-News/World-News/High-Energy-Costs-Continue-to-Plague-European-Industry.html Prices have since fallen but are still high compared to other countries. A poll by Germany's DIHK Chambers of Industry and Commerce of around 3,300 companies showed that 37% were considering cutting production or moving abroad, up from 31% last year and 16% in 2022. For energy-intensive industrial firms some 45% of companies were mulling slashing output or relocation, the survey showed. "The trust of the German economy in energy policy is severely damaged," Achim Dercks, DIHK deputy chief executive said, adding that the government had not succeeded in providing companies with a perspective for reliable and affordable energy supply. https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/more-german-companies-mull-relocation-due-high-energy-prices-survey-2024-08-01/ I've seen nothing to suggest energy prices in the EU are SO cheap that it's worth moving manufacturing TO Europe, and this is what annoys me the most. I've pointed this out before but they have an excellent report on the issues: https://commission.europa.eu/document/download/97e481fd-2dc3-412d-be4c-f152a8232961_en?filename=The+future+of+European+competitiveness+_+A+competitiveness+strategy+for+Europe.pdf Then they put out this Competitive Compass: https://commission.europa.eu/topics/eu-competitiveness/competitiveness-compass_en But tbh every week in the EU it seems like they are chasing after some other goal. This would be great, it would have been greater 10 years ago. Agreed
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    WTF I looked for something like this for a while and this never popped up. Awesome.
  • A receipt printer cured my procrastination [ADHD]

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    cygnosis@lemmy.worldC
    Good to know. Also an easy problem to fix. Just use phenol free paper.
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    S
    You could look into automatic local caching for diles you're planning to seed, and stick that on an SSD. That way you don't hammer the HDDs in the NAS and still get the good feels of seeding. Then automatically delete files once they get to a certain seed rate or something and you're golden. How aggressive you go with this depends on your actual use case. Are you actually editing raw footage over the network while multiple other clients are streaming other stuff? Or are you just interested in having it be capable? What's the budget? But that sounds complicated. I'd personally rather just DIY it, that way you can put an SSD in there for cache and you get most of the benefits with a lot less cost, and you should be able to respond to issues with minimal changes (i.e. add more RAM or another caching drive).