American made car? Ya, I own a Toyota Sienna. And ya, I don't think I'd buy an American brand again.

Eh, we'll see how that turns out. If they can release here at the price point they wanted ($25k-ish), I'd probably get one.

Buying what you prefer itself isn't an issue, but that should be the reason instead of "I need it because X, Y, Z." Most truck/SUV owners don't need a truck/SUV, they just want one.

My issue with trucks and SUVs are that they make the road more dangerous, since there's only so much a car manufacturer can do to protect against a vehicle more than twice as massive. That, and they're artificially cheap here in the US because of stupid regulations intended for farmers that got applied to them to reduce emissions standards.

How do you like it? It's on my short list for my next car.

If budget is the top of your list, EVs currently have high depreciation. You can easily find 2-year old EVs with low mileage for 50% off MSRP.

You're talking to a troll btw

wow what an argument.
I bet you never went there, it shows

piss off loser, you've been dealth with and should hide under a rock in shame where you belong.
You're literally an insect.
Your comment history proves it.
lay down and die already vermin.
Do i need to bloxk your annoying peasant ass or will you get in the gutter where you belong?

Capitalism is all about competition unless it's not.

Apologies if English isn't your first language it's called reading between the lines.

Ill draw it out for you: If people would pay that much (yes insane) money to go to "shit" and mediocre institutions here in the states, what does it say about the options they have locally?

I'm not sure how repairable EVs are either, since my 2013 Leaf never needed repairs in 12 years. Just tires and wiper blades.

To clarify, the bailouts of US car companies were Chrysler around 1980 and GM and Chrysler around 2008. To help them avoid bankruptcy and the resulting loss of jobs, they received loan guarantees (like having a cosigner) and direct loans, all of which they paid back. I think the public generally has a misconception that a corporate "bailout" means they just giving them money, but it doesn't.

Note - I'm not trying to convince you not to hate corporations, and there's no need for a lecture on how evil they are, I know they are. Just clarifying that one topic.

Glad you learned something!

The program started under W and ended under Obama and I think at the end the government actually made money off the deal.

Don't confuse this with the COVID PPP loans that were given out by Trump, forgiven by Trump, and then had a lot of the records about them destroyed by Trump.

Would be great if the competition was not about stealing others' technologies

Sienna's are great! I've owned 4 of them (because I tend to total cars), and been happy with all of them. Gets decent mileage for a van, and they hold value better than just about any other mini van. Never felt safer when ramming into the back of a semi while going 70mph! The van was totaled, but me and the kids were perfectly fine.

Yeah, I'm certainly looking around, but they also tend to have spyware. I just want a simple car that goes and stops when I say, and is really easy to repair if something goes wrong. EVs should be perfect for this, but for some reason manufacturers get away with tons of nonsense on them.

Bill Gates has entered the chat.

To be fair GM sold or closed a lot of its brands and foreign subsidiaries, and paid back the loan.

I fucking hate what the US auto industry has historically and is currently doing (making constantly bigger and more expensive trucks in a time we need smaller lighter EVs), but it’s actually a bit different from the SpaceX or EV credit subsidies and more of a low interest loan.

The US has far too many dispersed rural towns for public transit to cover. Yes we need more high speed rail and light rail, but we’re gonna need personal cars because of distances, weather and employment practices for a long time still. And there’s no reason they need to be 3 ton high speed blind spots.

I'd argue that a critical piece of competition for all nations has always been stealing knowledge and technology.