Former GM Executive: BYD cars are good in terms of design, features, price, quality. If we let BYD into the U.S. market, it could end up destroying american manufacturers
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Same. I'm looking into an EV, and I just want a simple car that goes and stops when I instruct it to. I don't need any kind of always-online service, I don't need cameras, etc, I just need to get to work and back.
Well, the US did have the slate truck coming up for really barebones options... But tariffs ruined that for now. Some of the lower budget Korean EVs have limited/optional connectivity.
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There is plenty of modern slave labor and exploitation going around. No major manufacutring nation is innocent.
What other "major manufacutring nation" oficially has this slave system?
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China builds cars using massive government subsidies, slave labor, and local resources that aren't available to anyone else in the world
Why are Japanese and Korean cars also better/cheaper than American cars then?
Slave labor
Citation needed
Massive government subsidies
The US doesn't massively subsidise auto-makers?
But yeah china bad
Why are Japanese and Korean cars also better/cheaper than American cars then?
They're not cheaper than American cars. Go price some out.
Citation needed
The US doesn't massively subsidise auto-makers?
China subsidizes Chinese companies. The US gives subsidies to manufacturers from all over the world via tax credits to buyers.
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Yeah, our VP rides around in a 2-door coupe and he's very tall, while my coworker (who is shorter) drives a big SUV because "he doesn't fit in smaller cars." I'm also tall and drive a Toyota Prius, which is small.
At the end of the day, none of that's legitimate, it's just an excuse to buy the car you prefer.
Larger cars should cost more because they take up more space, wear out the roads faster, and impact the environment more.
At the end of the day, none of that’s legitimate, it’s just an excuse to buy the car you prefer.
Since when is buying what we prefer considered negative? Calling it an excuse seems short-sighted.
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It might just be that, since BYD is serving such a large domestic market/population, that allows them to have cheaper cars? Something something, economies of scale. I'm no expert though.
There is a limit to that effect, though. And most observers agree that the state is subsidizing heavily.
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You’d have an argument if legacy manufacturers were trying. We could talk about support if they were willing. They don’t want it. They’ve already given up
By "legacy manufacturers" you mean every major auto manufacturer in the world that isn't based in China?Nobody else is selling new cars for as little as $4k because other countries aren't using slave labor in mines and factory floors. It's impossible to compete against that unless you engage in it yourself.
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Okay but see none of tjose are stock buybacks or exec bonuses, so...
So even Canada has lower labor costs because of universal healthcare.
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So they dont care about making cars for the world market, they just want regulations to allow them to milk the american market...
Decoupling the market was them admitting their stuff is not as popular to the global market
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Sadly, I think it was Biden that put a 100% tariff on Chinese EVs. Fuck Trump, but come on, Biden, don't do this shit for them. I really like that new Xiaomi YU7.
But the Chinese government could be spying on you if you bought a Chinese manufactured car!!
P.S. for bonus points, does anyone know where most GM automobiles are currently being manufactured?
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Good. Fuckem. They make shitty, oversized trucks that are a danger to pedestrians and people who drive reasonably sized cars anyway.
The Chinese too know how to make unnecessary large cars, unfortunately.
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What other "major manufacutring nation" oficially has this slave system?
I didn't say it's the same system, there are several different ways and degrees in which modern slavery exists. Trapping and exploiting migrant/seasonal workers is another popular one. Modern slavery exists from the US to Brazil, China/central Asia, Russia, Türkiye, even in parts of western Europe you'll find it in smaller or less obvious amounts.
Global Slavery Index | Walk Free
The 2023 Global Slavery Index provides an assessment of 160 countries, including an estimation of the number of people living in modern slavery, the extent to which a country’s population is vulnerable to modern slavery, and an examination of how well governments are responding to modern slavery.
Walk Free (www.walkfree.org)
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'Chinese or Indian backgrounds' so not Chinese.
China leads in 95% of STEM and they're only getting better and widening the gap.
The US has a handful of good Ivy league institutions (invariably using foreign professors and braindrain), the general level is mediocre at best.Yup and paying insane amounts of money to get in, too.
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But it would also help american people. Which is more important, I wonder.
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Did you forget all the bailouts US car manufacturers received?
Sadly, ever since “too big to fail”, any large corporation is now nearly indistinguishable from the federal government. Just another example of socialism for the rich, capitalism for the rest of us.
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It's state sponsored capitalism and China has pumped a ton of money into BYD to get them to where they are.
I can see them giving larger tax breaks to companies in the US, but current administration is all in on tariffs as the way to increase our domestic production. It doesn't make ours any better or cheaper, just everything else more expensive.
State sponsored capitalism is what everyone does. The only reason Tesla even exists is because of US government support
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But it would also help american people. Which is more important, I wonder.
Stop giving them more reasons not to allow it
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Tariffs be damned, I will not buy an American brand car. They've been mediocre my whole life and it's always been easier to source parts for Hondas and Toyotas. I'm not sure how repairable any EV is, but I doubt American brands will top the charts of value in repairability in my lifetime
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By "legacy manufacturers" you mean every major auto manufacturer in the world that isn't based in China?Nobody else is selling new cars for as little as $4k because other countries aren't using slave labor in mines and factory floors. It's impossible to compete against that unless you engage in it yourself.
Yet Chinese cars that meet US standards are quite a bit more than that. Where such vehicles are sold in developed markets, they are more like €30-40k
By “legacy manufacturers” I mean those who are stuck on internal combustion engines, and focusing on large trucks and luxury trims.
Average new car price in the US has greatly outpaced inflation and is currently almost $50k, closing in on a full year gross average income. Most people can’t afford that. For that rice you get old technology engine, old technology transmission, same features we’ve had for years.
Yet a replacement for my Subaru is much cheaper, only a little over what I paid nine years ago. It has safety features, electronics, and transmission more innovative than us made cars costing twice as much. Many more people can afford this vehicle, and it’s similar in price to what Chinese cars are selling for in Europe.
We don’t need to compete with $4k cars. We need to compete with cars affordable on average salaries, with new features and unique capabilities.
While the transition to electric vehicles has been politicized, it’s coming and it’s inexorable. “Legacy manufacturers” are those avoiding that change
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So even Canada has lower labor costs because of universal healthcare.
Yeah it turns out having infrastru'ture wnd a society is, like, efficient and stuff.
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Sadly, I think it was Biden that put a 100% tariff on Chinese EVs. Fuck Trump, but come on, Biden, don't do this shit for them. I really like that new Xiaomi YU7.
The issue is not so simple. Blocking BYD has a lot to do with protecting American manufacturing jobs. That's not to say Biden's tariff was the right answer. But it is a more complicated problem to solve than it appears from the perspective of a single car buyer.
