After 20 years of living with it, I've decided I don't like the downvote. The upvote is fine.

Reddit's founders, early on tried to encourage people to treat the downvote as moderation. It was meant to mean that a thing doesn't belong on reddit and people shouldn't see it. Of course that quickly became mere dislike or disagreement.

I'd prefer an approach that requires some input about what's wrong with a post in order to reduce its prominence; a restricted list of options as in Slashdot's moderation would be sufficient, I think. I'm not sure whether this should necessarily require also making a report to a more powerful admin/moderator, but I lean toward making that optional in most communities.

the problem is algorithms. during the whole bluesky promo all over lemmy while everyone was shitting on mastodon. the only thing that's broken is algorithms, and once you throw them out social media is immediately fixed - but of course the primary argument of mastodon vs bluesky was that mastodon requires you to curate your content (like joining a sub on reddit to see it on your front page stream, before algorithms fucked that site, and the thing is people LOVED old reddit so i fail to see how this is bad and doesn't work, but hey, all of lemmy said so, so who am i to blame) whereas bluesky being a relaunch of twitter and literally curating content for you no matter if you actually want to see it or not but for most people reactionary content is the only content they happily interact with anyway so algorithms makes a lot of sense for them because they feel they are engaging more with the site despite the pointless empty engagement they are doing instead of interacting with real users and real content on pages where you have to actively curate your content instead of being fed the lowest hanging fruit.

/ rant off

who will pay our representatives to push this through?

Particularly apt given that many of the biggest problems with social media are problems of capitalism. Social media platforms have found it most profitable to monetize conflict and division, the low self-esteem of teenagers, lies and misinformation, envy over the curated simulacrum of a life presented by a parasocial figure.

These things drive engagement. Engagement drives clicks. Clicks drive ad revenue. Revenue pleases shareholders. And all that feeds back into a system that trades negativity in the real world for positivity on a balance sheet.

Of course -corporate- social media can't be fixed ... it already works exactly they way they want it to...

This is spot on. The issue with any system is that people don’t pay attention to the incentives.

When a surgeon earns more if he does more surgeries with no downside, most surgeons in that system will obviously push for surgeries that aren’t necessary. How to balance incentives should be the main focus on any system that we’re part of.

You can pretty much understand someone else’s behavior by looking at what they’re gaining or what problem they’re avoiding by doing what they’re doing.

LeGuin is a treasure.

Exactly, the one big issue with the modern world is the algorithms pushing for engagement as the only important metric.

Reddit certainly had its problems but was actually pretty good for the ~15 years before it started getting enshittified more and more to try to extract value.

Facebook was pretty boring before they tried to make money. Still ick, but mostly just people posting pictures of activities with family or friends.

I’d prefer an approach that requires some input about what’s wrong with a post in order to reduce its prominence

A lot of the time, I downvote troll content that should not be engaged with. Like, not technically against the rules, but definitely someone who is not posting in good faith. If I responded to the post, I'd be contributing to the problem.

I don't mean replying, but selecting from a menu of possible reasons to downrank a post. Slashdot's moderation system that I mentioned earlier has (or had - haven't looked there in a while) "troll" as one of the categories.

I think just going back to internet forums circa early 2000s is probably a better way to engage honestly. They're still around, just not as "smartphone friendly" and doomscroll-enabled, due to the format.

I'm talking stuff like SomethingAwful, GaiaOnline, Fark, Newgrounds forum, GlockTalk, Slashdot, vBulletin etc.

These types of forums allowed you to discuss timely issues and news if you wanted. You could go a thousand miles deep on some bizarre subculture or stick to general discussion. They also had protomeme culture before that was a thing - aka "embedded image macros".

Anything that is topic focussed rather than following individuals is a big difference, and then take away the engagement algorithm and it’s much better.

Hi it's still broken on my machine. I've tried turning it off and on again

Because how to use it is baked into what it is. Like many big tech products, it’s not just a tool but also a philosophy. To use it is also to see the world through its (digital) eyes.

That's what I've been hoping for with Reddit and now Lemmy. I don't care about individuals, I care about topic based discussion.

My problem with forums is they are more like a club, where you get loss of off-topic discussion by people who happen to share an interest. I don't care what tech nerds think about medicine on a tech nerd forum, and joining dozens of forums to get the right discussion is a huge pain.

Forums are cool, and I use a few, but I really want a place that connects different subjects.

Although I love Lemmy, I find it will be hard to recommend a normal young person to hop on Lemmy, Mastodon, Kbin, Misskey, Iceshrimp, etc. Most people on here talk about tech and politics. If you scroll through the main feed, you won't get stuff from other communities unless you seek it out.

Not diverse enough, but once it gets diverse, it will probably enshitify and make the community mainstream garbage. Then we're back to square one with people making clickbait posts and attention seeking people.

social media is what it's made to be. social media as we use it is flawed.

all of the platforms just do different colors of the same damn thing.

Neat.

Release the epstein files then burn it all down.