matrix is cooked
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Here's Matrix CEOs answer to this article: https://lobste.rs/c/jekh0n -- according to him the article is absurd amounts of FUD
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 08:16 zuletzt editiert vonMan, that's depressing, thanks for sharing, that was well worth the read
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I like the concept of delta.chat the most. Anyone here use it? Any reason why it hasn't caught on?
Could it support technical FOSS channels with thousands of participants, like what IRC was awesome for and Matrix seems to be pretty ok at?
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 08:18 zuletzt editiert vonDeltachat works ok for 1:1 chats and small groups. It is totally unsuitable for large public channels as it doesn't really have a concept of group chats and just pretends so by (in email parlance) adds every one in 'CC'. This only works ok for small private groups.
IRC just needs to get it's shit together and start adopting IRCv3 features on the larger servers. The problem is really only that networks like libera.chat run a feature set that is at least 15 years behind what IRC can actually do.
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Deltachat works ok for 1:1 chats and small groups. It is totally unsuitable for large public channels as it doesn't really have a concept of group chats and just pretends so by (in email parlance) adds every one in 'CC'. This only works ok for small private groups.
IRC just needs to get it's shit together and start adopting IRCv3 features on the larger servers. The problem is really only that networks like libera.chat run a feature set that is at least 15 years behind what IRC can actually do.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 08:40 zuletzt editiert vonI never heard of ircv3 before. TIL. But, some parts of it don't seem irc-like, and sacrifice the aspects that have made me stay on irc all this time. Hmm. I'll look at it more later.
Welcome - IRCv3
Welcome to the IRCv3 Working Group. We're a group of IRC client and server software authors working to improve the IRC protocol.
(ircv3.net)
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Here's Matrix CEOs answer to this article: https://lobste.rs/c/jekh0n -- according to him the article is absurd amounts of FUD
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 09:01 zuletzt editiert vonSimpleX Chat – Many suggested this and I will explicitly recommend against it due to the founder's positions on various topics. This includes being anti-vaxx, believing COVID-19 was a hoax, trans- and homophobia, climate denial; In the SimpleX Groupchat he's also been seen basically bootlicking trump a couple times, but I've lost receipts to that.
I did not know this. I've seen people recommend SimpleX on lemmy too, but probably they didn't know.
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SimpleX Chat – Many suggested this and I will explicitly recommend against it due to the founder's positions on various topics. This includes being anti-vaxx, believing COVID-19 was a hoax, trans- and homophobia, climate denial; In the SimpleX Groupchat he's also been seen basically bootlicking trump a couple times, but I've lost receipts to that.
I did not know this. I've seen people recommend SimpleX on lemmy too, but probably they didn't know.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 09:39 zuletzt editiert von vga@sopuli.xyzAlthough I don't totally oppose judging people because of their views (shaming has been and can be a very useful for improving societies), I wonder if software written by such people should be. Seems to me that we don't have the abundance of software yet that would allow doing that.
Especially I'm wary of judging people for being dumb in applications like Twitter that use dark patterns to entice them into being dumb. In some way it feels to me like punching down, like blaming the victim.
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Deltachat works ok for 1:1 chats and small groups. It is totally unsuitable for large public channels as it doesn't really have a concept of group chats and just pretends so by (in email parlance) adds every one in 'CC'. This only works ok for small private groups.
IRC just needs to get it's shit together and start adopting IRCv3 features on the larger servers. The problem is really only that networks like libera.chat run a feature set that is at least 15 years behind what IRC can actually do.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 09:51 zuletzt editiert vonAh, too bad. That was perhaps too much to ask.
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Although I don't totally oppose judging people because of their views (shaming has been and can be a very useful for improving societies), I wonder if software written by such people should be. Seems to me that we don't have the abundance of software yet that would allow doing that.
Especially I'm wary of judging people for being dumb in applications like Twitter that use dark patterns to entice them into being dumb. In some way it feels to me like punching down, like blaming the victim.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 10:04 zuletzt editiert vonViews that seriously harm or endanger other people are dangerous.
If the founder would have opposing views in e.g. should we narrow down the car roads in cities and widen the pedestrian walks - ok. I think there's a lot to this question, I think pedestrian walks should be wider, cars are dangerous, etc. But this is not as dangerous as:
"Do you deny scientific evidence that COVID is real and a real danger to a lot of humans"
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Although I don't totally oppose judging people because of their views (shaming has been and can be a very useful for improving societies), I wonder if software written by such people should be. Seems to me that we don't have the abundance of software yet that would allow doing that.
Especially I'm wary of judging people for being dumb in applications like Twitter that use dark patterns to entice them into being dumb. In some way it feels to me like punching down, like blaming the victim.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 10:38 zuletzt editiert vonAre you asking if I insist that the minds behind my secure private chat have some moral standing and common sense? One would hope so. I wouldn't trust encryption made by anti-vaxer more than I would trust a plane put tougher by flat-earther. I don't want to be the hero of the next leopard eat my face song.
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Although I don't totally oppose judging people because of their views (shaming has been and can be a very useful for improving societies), I wonder if software written by such people should be. Seems to me that we don't have the abundance of software yet that would allow doing that.
Especially I'm wary of judging people for being dumb in applications like Twitter that use dark patterns to entice them into being dumb. In some way it feels to me like punching down, like blaming the victim.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 11:19 zuletzt editiert vonThis attitude has worked so well for allowing the current crop of tech billionaires to grow and cement their influence over the entire world. If people would just stop using their platforms when they hear the CEO's batshit views then they would be nobodies.
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Here's Matrix CEOs answer to this article: https://lobste.rs/c/jekh0n -- according to him the article is absurd amounts of FUD
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 11:31 zuletzt editiert vonI think it’d help them a lot to disable new signups on the m.org home server for a while and direct people to some of the other popular options, they spend too much on their own example server imo
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I think it’d help them a lot to disable new signups on the m.org home server for a while and direct people to some of the other popular options, they spend too much on their own example server imo
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 11:38 zuletzt editiert vonPersonally have been hosting my own server for me and friends. Cheaper and easier than I expected it to be
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Are you asking if I insist that the minds behind my secure private chat have some moral standing and common sense? One would hope so. I wouldn't trust encryption made by anti-vaxer more than I would trust a plane put tougher by flat-earther. I don't want to be the hero of the next leopard eat my face song.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 12:17 zuletzt editiert von vga@sopuli.xyzI wouldn’t trust encryption made by anti-vaxer
My understanding of encryption is that the point is that you don't have to trust the people doing it. You just have to trust the security research community that proved that the algorithms/protocols work. Or if you're a hardcore security guy yourself, you can review it yourself.
Also, my understanding of people is that what they seem like is no evidence for what kind of people they really are.
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SimpleX Chat – Many suggested this and I will explicitly recommend against it due to the founder's positions on various topics. This includes being anti-vaxx, believing COVID-19 was a hoax, trans- and homophobia, climate denial; In the SimpleX Groupchat he's also been seen basically bootlicking trump a couple times, but I've lost receipts to that.
I did not know this. I've seen people recommend SimpleX on lemmy too, but probably they didn't know.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 12:25 zuletzt editiert vonSo happy the article linked to the Fediverse post, immediately liked and boosted it.
Never used SimpleX much really but will be immediately uninstalling it. Saw the guy's tweets, he's fucking insane, and retweets RFK Jr
. Will do my best to inform others. -
I wouldn’t trust encryption made by anti-vaxer
My understanding of encryption is that the point is that you don't have to trust the people doing it. You just have to trust the security research community that proved that the algorithms/protocols work. Or if you're a hardcore security guy yourself, you can review it yourself.
Also, my understanding of people is that what they seem like is no evidence for what kind of people they really are.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 13:10 zuletzt editiert vonOn the other hand, when people show they who they really are... you should believe them. There are some views that are either ignorant or bad will. I think evidence of those is a reasonable deal-breaker. And it's perfectly ok if you have your line drown somewhere else as well.
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SimpleX Chat – Many suggested this and I will explicitly recommend against it due to the founder's positions on various topics. This includes being anti-vaxx, believing COVID-19 was a hoax, trans- and homophobia, climate denial; In the SimpleX Groupchat he's also been seen basically bootlicking trump a couple times, but I've lost receipts to that.
I did not know this. I've seen people recommend SimpleX on lemmy too, but probably they didn't know.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 13:32 zuletzt editiert vonMe neither, this is actually disgusting, immediately uninstalled, a founder that has these views most likely shouldn’t be trusted with your data, anyway.
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Here's Matrix CEOs answer to this article: https://lobste.rs/c/jekh0n -- according to him the article is absurd amounts of FUD
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 13:41 zuletzt editiert vonVC funding destroys everything it touches.
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SimpleX Chat – Many suggested this and I will explicitly recommend against it due to the founder's positions on various topics. This includes being anti-vaxx, believing COVID-19 was a hoax, trans- and homophobia, climate denial; In the SimpleX Groupchat he's also been seen basically bootlicking trump a couple times, but I've lost receipts to that.
I did not know this. I've seen people recommend SimpleX on lemmy too, but probably they didn't know.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 15:46 zuletzt editiert vonFuck... Is there an alternative?
Can't use telegram cus banned, won't use signal because usa and for a while they got very buddy-buddy with the zucc, matrix requires me hosting and it isn't exactly private... So what's left? -
Fuck... Is there an alternative?
Can't use telegram cus banned, won't use signal because usa and for a while they got very buddy-buddy with the zucc, matrix requires me hosting and it isn't exactly private... So what's left?schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 15:52 zuletzt editiert vonThe write-up I'm referencing has some at the end. Maybe Delta chat?
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Fuck... Is there an alternative?
Can't use telegram cus banned, won't use signal because usa and for a while they got very buddy-buddy with the zucc, matrix requires me hosting and it isn't exactly private... So what's left?schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 16:55 zuletzt editiert vonwhy does matrix require you self hosting? There’s a bunch of free open-signup servers available
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I wouldn’t trust encryption made by anti-vaxer
My understanding of encryption is that the point is that you don't have to trust the people doing it. You just have to trust the security research community that proved that the algorithms/protocols work. Or if you're a hardcore security guy yourself, you can review it yourself.
Also, my understanding of people is that what they seem like is no evidence for what kind of people they really are.
schrieb am 16. Juni 2025, 18:29 zuletzt editiert vonIt's a tricky line. On one hand, I agree that you don't need to trust the person—just the code and the cryptographic model. But at the same time, if the dev is actively pushing misinformation or has a history of hostility toward marginalized groups, it erodes my confidence in their ethical choices about security and privacy. Trust isn’t just technical.
